Suggestions for stage setup. L1 Compact, T1, L1 Compact - Rene

Hi @Rene,
Thanks for using The Sketcher!

 
-- click image to make changes to the live version --

Quoting Rene from The Sketcher
Hi, I hope this diagram is clear enough....
1. What kind(s) of music you play?
- Mostly Jazz, sometimes Rock n Roll and a bit of country, funk or pop.2. Where you do it (size, type of venue)?
- Mostly ballrooms in resorts and hotels.
3. Who is there (audience) - how many?
- Wedding guests of up to 500 people
4. What are they doing while you are performing?
- Mostly eating, sometimes focusing on us if we're especially good that night.
5. Do you have a website? If no website, please post a picture of your ensemble.
- Will post a current pic soon.

I'm a singer and guitarist. I bought the L1 Compact about 10 years ago, when I first started performing in a jazz duo with pianist/keyboardist. Most of our gigs are in wedding ballrooms and smaller, for up to 500 guests.

When we play as a duo, my voice will go to Ch1 of the Tonematch, my guitar Ch2, and the keyboard goes to Ch5. We then take the Master Out of the Tonematch and connect it to the Guitar input of the Compact.

The Compact is usually about 2-4 feet behind the keyboardist, angled away from me, just in case there's feedback, but to be honest, we've never had a problem with that. (also i recently found out that it's not necessary to place it an angle it if we're standing 8 feet in front of it, so we might try that soon)

In most cases, we then take a line out from the back of the Compact, and into the hotel's system. Surprisingly, on one occasion, due to the floor being completely made of wood, we are able to use the Compact on it's own, and it was loud enough to fill the whole hall, without any degradation of sound.

When we perform as a Trio, we usually add a saxophonist, and have him going through Channel 3 of the Tonematch, and when we use backing tracks, we connect that to the RCA inputs of the Compact.

Once we add a female singer, then we can't all go through the Tonematch, and either the saxophonist or the female singer has to go directly into the Compact's XLR input. Due to the lack of effects, usually the sax will have to go directly to the Compact.

A few days ago, we were hired for an event at a 5 star resort, but we could not connect to the hotel's pa system, as it caused buzzing or humming. However, I found somewone who recently purchased the L1 Model 2, and since it's made for 500 people, we got the client to hire him and the L1.

However, this is all pretty new for us, so we're not too sure what the ideal way of hooking up the L1s together would be. In the end, we used the Compact as our monitor, with the Tonematch to control our onstage sound and volume, and the Model 2 was used to amplify our sound. The model 2 was offstage in front of us angled 90 degrees across the hall, while the Compact, was angled perpendicular to that, basically in an XY kind of configuration.

The female vocalist, saxophonist and bluetooth backing tracks all went to the sound engineers mixer, which then went back into my Tonematch. This made it hard to control the volume of the backing tracks when it was quieter than the vocalist and sax.

However, the clients and guests were all happy with the sound, but I felt that we hadn't configured everything properly. We plan to be working with the Model 2 for future gigs, so we want to try to create the ideal setup.

Based on what I've seen, I think we could probably put both L1s behind us, but would like advice on what people think is the best setup to use.

Thanks in advance!

Rene

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Original Post

Hi Rene,



Quoting Rene from The Sketcher
Hi, I hope this diagram is clear enough....
Yes, thanks for using the Sketcher.

1. What kind(s) of music you play?
- Mostly Jazz, sometimes Rock n Roll and a bit of country, funk or pop.2. Where you do it (size, type of venue)?
- Mostly ballrooms in resorts and hotels.
3. Who is there (audience) - how many?
- Wedding guests of up to 500 people
4. What are they doing while you are performing?
- Mostly eating, sometimes focusing on us if we're especially good that night.
5. Do you have a website? If no website, please post a picture of your ensemble.
- Will post a current pic soon.
Cool.

I'm a singer and guitarist. I bought the L1 Compact about 10 years ago, when I first started performing in a jazz duo with pianist/keyboardist. Most of our gigs are in wedding ballrooms and smaller, for up to 500 guests.

When we play as a duo, my voice will go to Ch1 of the Tonematch, my guitar Ch2, and the keyboard goes to Ch5. We then take the Master Out of the Tonematch and connect it to the Guitar input of the Compact.
That all sounds good.  The ToneMatch switch should be set to Line Level (down position).


The Compact is usually about 2-4 feet behind the keyboardist, angled away from me, just in case there's feedback, but to be honest, we've never had a problem with that. (also i recently found out that it's not necessary to place it an angle it if we're standing 8 feet in front of it, so we might try that soon)
With the wide dispersion pattern, it's not necessary to angle it (most of the time). There's always and exception, but this doesn't sound like one.


In most cases, we then take a line out from the back of the Compact, and into the hotel's system. Surprisingly, on one occasion, due to the floor being completely made of wood, we are able to use the Compact on it's own, and it was loud enough to fill the whole hall, without any degradation of sound.
Nice. I like things when they are simple.


When we perform as a Trio, we usually add a saxophonist, and have him going through Channel 3 of the Tonematch, and when we use backing tracks, we connect that to the RCA inputs of the Compact.
All good. It sounds like you're getting a lot of value out of your system.


Once we add a female singer, then we can't all go through the Tonematch, and either the saxophonist or the female singer has to go directly into the Compact's XLR input. Due to the lack of effects, usually the sax will have to go directly to the Compact.
That's how I would approach it.


A few days ago, we were hired for an event at a 5 star resort, but we could not connect to the hotel's pa system, as it caused buzzing or humming. However, I found somewone who recently purchased the L1 Model 2, and since it's made for 500 people, we got the client to hire him and the L1.

However, this is all pretty new for us, so we're not too sure what the ideal way of hooking up the L1s together would be. In the end, we used the Compact as our monitor, with the Tonematch to control our onstage sound and volume, and the Model 2 was used to amplify our sound. The model 2 was offstage in front of us angled 90 degrees across the hall, while the Compact, was angled perpendicular to that, basically in an XY kind of configuration.
Sounds good.  In future, you can run L1 Compact Line out to the Model II Power Stand  analog input.


The female vocalist, saxophonist and bluetooth backing tracks all went to the sound engineers mixer, which then went back into my Tonematch. This made it hard to control the volume of the backing tracks when it was quieter than the vocalist and sax.
The path through the engineer's mixer - sure I can see how that would make it difficult to manage the relative volumes.


However, the clients and guests were all happy with the sound, but I felt that we hadn't configured everything properly. We plan to be working with the Model 2 for future gigs, so we want to try to create the ideal setup.

Based on what I've seen, I think we could probably put both L1s behind us, but would like advice on what people think is the best setup to use.

Thanks in advance!

Rene
You can put both L1®s behind you, but with your setup - L1 Compact as monitor and L1 Model II as Front of House, you don't have to change anything. 
ST

Thanks ST, 

We're considering of having both L1s behind us for our next gig. I saw a number of Bose videos showing this arrangement mostly using 2 L1s, and sometimes using 3.

If both the Model II and the Compact is behind us, which option would be better?

1. Run the L1 Compact Line out to the Model II Power Stand analog input and have all 4 of us coming through both speakers.

2. Have 2 of us going through the Model II via the Tonematch, while the other 2 go through the mixer to the Compact.

Would it be correct to say that in the 2nd setup, the 2 on the left would go through the left speaker, and the 2 on the right would go through the right speaker, or does it really not matter with such a small combo?

In terms of musician placement, the keyboardist and I are the name of the band, with the sax and the female vocalist in supporting roles.

Is it common practice to have both singers in the centre, with instruments on the side, or would it be just as fine to have the keyboard and me in the centre, with the supporting roles on the sides?

I've edited the layout to see what you think.

Thanks again!

Rene

This was our setup a few days ago. The name of our band is the Asif & Rene Jazz Band. The keyboardist is Asif on the right of the photo, and I'm on the left hand side, singing and playing guitar. 

For the next gig, I'm thinking of switching places with the saxophonist, or having Asif and I switch places with the female vocalist and sax player.

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Hi Rene,

Rene posted:

Thanks ST, 

We're considering of having both L1s behind us for our next gig. I saw a number of Bose videos showing this arrangement mostly using 2 L1s, and sometimes using 3.

This works best when all the L1 systems are the same model.



If both the Model II and the Compact is behind us, which option would be better?

In small rooms, this might work fine.

In larger rooms, it may not be a good match. Here's why.

  • If you run the L1® Model II and L1® Compact at the same stage volume the L1® Model II project sounds much farther than the L1® Compact 
    • In a small room you might not notice the difference
    • In a larger room, you will hear the L1® Model II at a greater distance than the L1® Compact.
  • As you move away from the stage, the sound from the L1® Compact will drop off faster than the L1® Model II
    • You may hear everything fine in front of the stage but at the back of the room, you'll hear the sound from the L1® Model II better than the L1® Compact




1. Run the L1 Compact Line out to the Model II Power Stand analog input and have all 4 of us coming through both speakers.

This might give you a better monitoring experience on stage, but it won't do much for the audience.



2. Have 2 of us going through the Model II via the Tonematch, while the other 2 go through the mixer to the Compact.

If you were running two of the same model, I would do as you described putting two performers through each system.



Would it be correct to say that in the 2nd setup, the 2 on the left would go through the left speaker, and the 2 on the right would go through the right speaker, or does it really not matter with such a small combo?

Yes - using two of the same model.



In terms of musician placement, the keyboardist and I are the name of the band, with the sax and the female vocalist in supporting roles.

Is it common practice to have both singers in the centre, with instruments on the side, or would it be just as fine to have the keyboard and me in the centre, with the supporting roles on the sides?

This is all up to you and the visual presentation you want to offer your audience.

If you were using two of the same model I would do this

  • Rene (vocal) with guitar and female vocalist heard through one L1®
  • Asif (keyboard) heard and Sax heard through the other L1®


I've edited the layout to see what you think.

Thanks again!

Rene

This picture looks good to me.

ST

Thanks again ST,

We don't really have access to a 2nd Model II so in this situation, where we have a Compact and a Model II, would it then be better to have everyone going through both systems so that people would hear the same sound?

Rene

Hi Rene,

Given what you've told us,


 In the end, we used the Compact as our monitor, with the Tonematch to control our onstage sound and volume, and the Model 2 was used to amplify our sound. The model 2 was offstage in front of us angled 90 degrees across the hall, while the Compact, was angled perpendicular to that, basically in an XY kind of configuration.
I would keep doing this for a room of 500.
You can try using just the L1® Model II behind you without the L1 Compact. That will be simpler of course. You'd have to try it to hear if you prefer the result.
ST

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