L1 Model II

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Using proprietary Bose® technology, L1 systems combine  PA and monitors into a single, highly portable unit. The  loudspeaker can be positioned behind or to the side —and you hear what the audience hears.

Highly portable PA and monitor combined for solo performers, DJs and general-purpose use. Fixed vertical control with 180° horizontal coverage Reduced vulnerability to feedback.

Three systems to choose from (Compact, Model 1S, Model II)
Two passive bass module options (B1 or B2)
Consistent coverage and tonal balance, portability and easy setup.

How to use single L1 model2 for 3 vocals on a large stage

Hi all,

We're a rock cover band with 3 vocals wanting to replace regular PA/monitors with a single L1 model2 with B2 and T1.

This is a permanent stage approx 24' wide x 10' deep. The room is approx 24' wide and 60' long. We usually have gigs there of up to 100 people.

You can view the stage sketch here 



We get feedback from vocal 1 and 2, and after much fiddling with EQ and Para EQ we don't seem to be hearing ourselves as well as we used to with the old PA, and not too sure about the overall volume. The mics are all Shure Beta 58a.

Would we be better off moving the L1 to either corner instead of center? If so, I can easily factory reset the T1 and start again.

Any other suggestions would be great, as this may not work for us with a single L1, not sure.

Cheers,

Dave Matthews

 

Edit - inserted Sketch
Bose Pro Community Admin 

Original Post

Try running the L1 next to the band - one side or the other just in front of the drummer so she/he can hear the band and as far away from the vocal mics (mic 1 or 3) as you can manage.

(Another option is get a Bose S1 Pro to use as a drum monitor and place the L1 in line with the vocal microphones)

In one of my bands, we often play with an L1S cranked up pretty high to cover a half acre outdoors and placed next to the band and we don't have any significant problems with feedback or monitoring (3 vocals, harmonica, 2 acoustic guitars, Bass and Congas). 

Once you get used to monitoring the band with sidewash instead of direct sound, it's not a problem.

Dealing with a similar question using same setup (with 8 channel mixer). Does your band include drums? With our 4-piece full band I’ve found drums to be limiting factor as far as stage volume being too loud and inducing feedback. I also play in an acoustic vocal trio, no drums - my L1 M2 and B2 work like a dream even sitting 3’ behind us running 3 vocals, 2 guitars, 1 bass. We had a full band bar gig recently for CD release and I considered pairing the L1 out front with a L1 compact but in the end went back to our JBL PA which I knew would be LOUD even if it didn’t have the quality of the Bose. It’s always the drummer’s fault :-)

3 singers are worth hearing. I love this system for Acoustic music but for the configuration in your drawing, I would be wanting to play at a low volume to limit vocal tone masking from bass and drums, especially cymbals, guitar distortion, etc. not to mention room noise.  I guess I'm pointing out the obvious and if that isn't it, just ignore, but I say that because I rarely hear a band at any level that doesn't bury their vocals with instrument volume. With a full band, you would really have to manage your mix well. If you already are, let me know how you do it so I can teach my band.

ST posted:

Hi Dave Matthews,

Please check out these tips about

Microphone Feedback

ST

Thanks ST. I had gain staged each mic up to just getting into yellow, however I had done this after choosing the correct mic type. I see in the T4/8s example that the gain stage trim was done first, then the correct mic was chosen. Does this make any difference at all? The T1 video does mic choice first.

 

Cheers,

Dave

Jay posted:

We use a single L1 model 2 for 3 vocals in rock cover band , have never had issue.   It's in the center with 3 vocals with factory presets for mics .   About 6 feet behind us and volume is about 12 ockock

Thanks Jay!

Good to know you have success with a similar setup!

Chet 3 posted:

Try running the L1 next to the band - one side or the other just in front of the drummer so she/he can hear the band and as far away from the vocal mics (mic 1 or 3) as you can manage.

(Another option is get a Bose S1 Pro to use as a drum monitor and place the L1 in line with the vocal microphones)

In one of my bands, we often play with an L1S cranked up pretty high to cover a half acre outdoors and placed next to the band and we don't have any significant problems with feedback or monitoring (3 vocals, harmonica, 2 acoustic guitars, Bass and Congas). 

Once you get used to monitoring the band with sidewash instead of direct sound, it's not a problem.

Hi Chet,

Yes, I may have to move it to either side of the stage. Hopefully I won't need to add a monitor.

Cheers,

Dave

FCBlues posted:

3 singers are worth hearing. I love this system for Acoustic music but for the configuration in your drawing, I would be wanting to play at a low volume to limit vocal tone masking from bass and drums, especially cymbals, guitar distortion, etc. not to mention room noise.  I guess I'm pointing out the obvious and if that isn't it, just ignore, but I say that because I rarely hear a band at any level that doesn't bury their vocals with instrument volume. With a full band, you would really have to manage your mix well. If you already are, let me know how you do it so I can teach my band.

Lol!

I know what you mean! We do try very hard NOT to be too loud in our room. Not interested in going deaf. So we have convos about it whenever any one of us feels the volume creep has gone overboard!

Hi Dave,

Great question!

Dave Matthews posted:
ST posted:

Hi Dave Matthews,

Please check out these tips about

Microphone Feedback

ST

Thanks ST. I had gain staged each mic up to just getting into yellow, however I had done this after choosing the correct mic type. I see in the T4/8s example that the gain stage trim was done first, then the correct mic was chosen. Does this make any difference at all? The T1 video does mic choice first.

 

Cheers,

Dave

It doesn't make a difference. The channel trims come before any other processing in the signal chain.

ST

ST posted:

Hi Dave,

Great question!

Dave Matthews posted:
ST posted:

Hi Dave Matthews,

Please check out these tips about

Microphone Feedback

ST

Thanks ST. I had gain staged each mic up to just getting into yellow, however I had done this after choosing the correct mic type. I see in the T4/8s example that the gain stage trim was done first, then the correct mic was chosen. Does this make any difference at all? The T1 video does mic choice first.

 

Cheers,

Dave

It doesn't make a difference. The channel trims come before any other processing in the signal chain.

ST

OK, I guess I'll have to try again.

The L1 is maybe 7' behind me, and I get feedback before feeling like we can hear ourselves.

Would gain staging without hitting any yellow help? I'm guessing I'd just have to increase the main vol and end up in the same situation.

I'd say that the setting the L1 only 7 feet behind you with a louder band is not enough.  I suspect to get the volume you need with even a reasonably loud rock band you would have to set it at least 15-20 feet behind to avoid excessive feedback.

You are stuck between the rock and hard place of the sound pressure level you need and the inverse square rule that limits how quickly it dissipates before reaching the microphones.

For example, at a gig a few years back I had to cover 350 people in a large hall, we had to physically move large pieces of the stage from the side to add to the front of the stage to put the lead singer/acoustic guitar on his own platform in order to get the 12 feet plus distance I needed to fill that hall without the lead vocal feeding back.

Have you tried putting the Bose next to the band?

I know folks often get hung up in symmetry.  When positioning a band on a stage the tendency is to spread everyone out so that they fill the stage width with the mass centered.  Your issue is that your stage is 24' wide but ONLY 10' deep.  I suspect that there's no way you're going to be able to get the Bose back far enough on your stage to avoid feedback.  If I were you, I'd try my suggestions:

1) First try the Bose completely stage left (or right) in line with the drummer's ears (or slightly forward of them) so he/she can hear the band and then place the other three of you closer together near the opposite side of the stage.  The side wash from Bose L1 systems is amazing.

2) If still getting feedback, you may have to provide a separate monitor for the drummer if you must keep the drums behind you and move the Bose forward so it's in line with the front line of microphones. 

3) Or you could start a new trend and put all four of you in a line with the Bose next to you on one side or the other.  Gene Krupa and Buddy Rich used to sit in the FRONT of the band! 

Note: the apparent asymmetry can be visually attenuated by putting a sound transparent curtain in front of the Bose location that would cut the audience's sight lines down to just the band.

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