Daisy chaining two S1 Pros

Question #1:  with two S1 Pro speakers behind me and about 10-15 feet apart at the narrow end (on stage) of a rectangular room 20 feet x 50 feet, would sending vocals to one speaker and guitar to the other speaker be preferable or would it be better to daisy chain the speakers in mono?

Question #2: if daisy chaining the speakers in mono, is it safe to assume that tonematch eq, additional eq adjustments and reverb will be sent to the second speaker?

I am also purchasing the T1 to allow for more inputs so I will have this to add to the equation as well.

Any additional thoughts on this set up are appreciated.

Many thanks!

 

 

 

Original Post

Hi Simon Patrick,

Welcome to our community. I'm glad you're here.

Let me start here:

Simon Patrick posted:

I am also purchasing the T1 to allow for more inputs so I will have this to add to the equation as well.

If you are looking for the greatest flexibility - you'll want to consider getting the T4S instead of the T1. I understand that it's more money, but the T4S is better designed to work with two S1 Pro systems than the T1. 



Simon Patrick posted:

I am also purchasing the T1 to allow for more inputs so I will have this to add to the equation as well.

Please say more about the other inputs you will have (in addition to your vocals and guitar).

Simon Patrick posted:

Question #1:  with two S1 Pro speakers behind me and about 10-15 feet apart at the narrow end (on stage) of a rectangular room 20 feet x 50 feet, would sending vocals to one speaker and guitar to the other speaker be preferable or would it be better to daisy chain the speakers in mono?

The easiest thing is to daisy chain the speakers in mono and doing that, I would put the S1 Pro systems about 10-15 feet apart as you said.

When you say "vocals", are we talking about more than one vocalist? If so, then you could make things really interesting by separating the vocalists send each vocalist to only one S1 Pro and panning the guitar up the middle.

The T4S is engineered to do this kind of thing. You can't do this kind of thing with the T1.

Question #2: if daisy chaining the speakers in mono, is it safe to assume that tonematch eq, additional eq adjustments and reverb will be sent to the second speaker?

Yes.



I am also purchasing the T1 to allow for more inputs so I will have this to add to the equation as well.

Any additional thoughts on this set up are appreciated.

Many thanks!

Please tell us more about your music and where you perform.

Let's see where that takes us.

Thanks,

ST

HI Simon. Question 1: I've tried it both ways and prefer to just daisy chain in mono. To me it seems to present a more balanced all-around sound.  I'm also assuming you mean only one guitar and one vocal. WIth more instruments or vocals, splitting the sounds may work out well. Answer to Question 2 is "yes."

ST posted:

Hi Simon Patrick,

Welcome to our community. I'm glad you're here.

Let me start here:

Simon Patrick posted:

I am also purchasing the T1 to allow for more inputs so I will have this to add to the equation as well.

If you are looking for the greatest flexibility - you'll want to consider getting the T4S instead of the T1. I understand that it's more money, but the T4S is better designed to work with two S1 Pro systems than the T1. 



Simon Patrick posted:

I am also purchasing the T1 to allow for more inputs so I will have this to add to the equation as well.

Please say more about the other inputs you will have (in addition to your vocals and guitar).

Simon Patrick posted:

Question #1:  with two S1 Pro speakers behind me and about 10-15 feet apart at the narrow end (on stage) of a rectangular room 20 feet x 50 feet, would sending vocals to one speaker and guitar to the other speaker be preferable or would it be better to daisy chain the speakers in mono?

The easiest thing is to daisy chain the speakers in mono and doing that, I would put the S1 Pro systems about 10-15 feet apart as you said.

When you say "vocals", are we talking about more than one vocalist? If so, then you could make things really interesting by separating the vocalists send each vocalist to only one S1 Pro and panning the guitar up the middle.

The T4S is engineered to do this kind of thing. You can't do this kind of thing with the T1.

Question #2: if daisy chaining the speakers in mono, is it safe to assume that tonematch eq, additional eq adjustments and reverb will be sent to the second speaker?

Yes.



I am also purchasing the T1 to allow for more inputs so I will have this to add to the equation as well.

Any additional thoughts on this set up are appreciated.

Many thanks!

Please tell us more about your music and where you perform.

Let's see where that takes us.

Thanks,

ST

Thank you for the warm welcome.  

At this point in time I am playing acoustic guitar and singing solo at a little tavern.  Ceilings are low and room is about 20x50. Crowd size varies from a few people to maybe 50. Guitar is a combination of finger style and strumming...music is heavy on the country but a mix of many genres, new and old.

I also play in nursing homes and currently require an additional mic input for my daughter who accompanies me.  She also plays guitar and soon will be accompanying new on guitar as well at gigs.

Thank you ST for the heads up regarding the T4 being a better option for 2 S1 Pros than the T1.  Other than sending the respective vocals of two singers to the different speakers and panning the guitars down the middle, would there be an added benefit(s) to having the T4 over the T1?  

Thank you!

 

Archtop Eddy posted:

HI Simon. Question 1: I've tried it both ways and prefer to just daisy chain in mono. To me it seems to present a more balanced all-around sound.  I'm also assuming you mean only one guitar and one vocal. WIth more instruments or vocals, splitting the sounds may work out well. Answer to Question 2 is "yes."

I tend to agree with you Eddy when it comes to solo acoustic and vocals.  It will be interesting to experiment once an additional vocalist and guitar are part of the mix.  Thanks!

Archtop Eddy posted:

You're welcome Simon. Regarding question #2, let me add... Set your EQ setting using the first/main S1 and set the EQ settings flat on your second (daisy-chained) S1 so that it won't color the sound/settings coming out of your first/main S1.

Thanks Eddy for clarifying.  Would you be able to comment on how to safely boost the output (volume) of a single S1 with guitar and sm58 to a level comparable to what you would hear when using bluetooth and sending music to the S1.  Is a preamp required to boost the signal of the guitar' s preamp and the mic?  I also notice that the second s1 when daisy chained (mono) is significantly louder. 

Simon Patrick posted:

Thanks Eddy for clarifying.  Would you be able to comment on how to safely boost the output (volume) of a single S1 with guitar and sm58 to a level comparable to what you would hear when using bluetooth and sending music to the S1.  Is a preamp required to boost the signal of the guitar' s preamp and the mic?  I also notice that the second s1 when daisy chained (mono) is significantly louder. 

I think it's best if I leave that answer to someone who uses an sm58. I use a Boss VE-8 acoustic singer gizmo box which boosts and modifies both the guitar and mic (Sennheiser or Neumann). I agree with you that canned music through the bluetooth is generally louder. But that seems to be the case with most PA systems I use -- probably since the volume of canned music is generally boosted in the mastering phase.  Also, daisy chained S1 may be louder than the first S1.  In both case above, I adjust the volume as appropriate on one or the other S1 unit. 

Archtop Eddy posted:
Simon Patrick posted:

Thanks Eddy for clarifying.  Would you be able to comment on how to safely boost the output (volume) of a single S1 with guitar and sm58 to a level comparable to what you would hear when using bluetooth and sending music to the S1.  Is a preamp required to boost the signal of the guitar' s preamp and the mic?  I also notice that the second s1 when daisy chained (mono) is significantly louder. 

I think it's best if I leave that answer to someone who uses an sm58. I use a Boss VE-8 acoustic singer gizmo box which boosts and modifies both the guitar and mic (Sennheiser or Neumann). I agree with you that canned music through the bluetooth is generally louder. But that seems to be the case with most PA systems I use -- probably since the volume of canned music is generally boosted in the mastering phase.  Also, daisy chained S1 may be louder than the first S1.  In both case above, I adjust the volume as appropriate on one or the other S1 unit. 

Thanks Eddy!

Hi Simon,

Simon Patrick posted:

Thank you for the warm welcome.  

At this point in time I am playing acoustic guitar and singing solo at a little tavern.  Ceilings are low and room is about 20x50. Crowd size varies from a few people to maybe 50. Guitar is a combination of finger style and strumming...music is heavy on the country but a mix of many genres, new and old.

Thanks for this information. It's nice to know you better.

For your solo work in this room, you may not need both S1 Pro systems. Take both and try using just one.

If you use both, you can try putting them closer together behind you (say 10 feet apart).  Run the microphone to one and the guitar to the other. You may get better gain-before-feedback and a little more clarity. It's worth checking it out to see if you like it. This will take one less cable than doing the daisy chain.



I also play in nursing homes and currently require an additional mic input for my daughter who accompanies me.  She also plays guitar and soon will be accompanying new on guitar as well at gigs.

Time for the T4S, or more simply, put you and your guitar through one S1 Pro system and your daughter and her guitar through the other.  This will make your show more interesting because of the Cocktail Party Effect.  



Thank you ST for the heads up regarding the T4 being a better option for 2 S1 Pros than the T1.  Other than sending the respective vocals of two singers to the different speakers and panning the guitars down the middle, would there be an added benefit(s) to having the T4 over the T1?  

Thank you!

I would try using the two S1 Pro systems as I described immediately above first. If you need more flexibility, the T4S will give you more options, more control over EQ and depending on how you use it; it's easier to connect backing tracks through the Auxiliary channels.

Does that help?

ST

ST posted:

Hi Simon,

Simon Patrick posted:

Thank you for the warm welcome.  

At this point in time I am playing acoustic guitar and singing solo at a little tavern.  Ceilings are low and room is about 20x50. Crowd size varies from a few people to maybe 50. Guitar is a combination of finger style and strumming...music is heavy on the country but a mix of many genres, new and old.

Thanks for this information. It's nice to know you better.

For your solo work in this room, you may not need both S1 Pro systems. Take both and try using just one.

If you use both, you can try putting them closer together behind you (say 10 feet apart).  Run the microphone to one and the guitar to the other. You may get better gain-before-feedback and a little more clarity. It's worth checking it out to see if you like it. This will take one less cable than doing the daisy chain.



I also play in nursing homes and currently require an additional mic input for my daughter who accompanies me.  She also plays guitar and soon will be accompanying new on guitar as well at gigs.

Time for the T4S, or more simply, put you and your guitar through one S1 Pro system and your daughter and her guitar through the other.  This will make your show more interesting because of the Cocktail Party Effect.  



Thank you ST for the heads up regarding the T4 being a better option for 2 S1 Pros than the T1.  Other than sending the respective vocals of two singers to the different speakers and panning the guitars down the middle, would there be an added benefit(s) to having the T4 over the T1?  

Thank you!

I would try using the two S1 Pro systems as I described immediately above first. If you need more flexibility, the T4S will give you more options, more control over EQ and depending on how you use it; it's easier to connect backing tracks through the Auxiliary channels.

Does that help?

ST

Hi ST yes it helps very much.  Thank you very much for all the info.

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