Discussions about the Bose S1 Pro system

Bose S1 Pro

Designed for musicians, DJs and general PA use, the S1 Pro is the ultimate all-in-one PA, floor monitor and practice amplifier that's ready to be your go-anywhere Bluetooth music system for nearly any occasion. 

This is the place to discuss the S1 Pro system.

nightout: Are you looking for more kick for a BASS or more "bass" for your system?

If it's more kick for a BASS, another option is to plug the bass into a Phil Jones Pure Sound Briefcase amp.

You can put a rechargeable 12V motorcycle battery into it which will run it for a "number of" hours - probably more than the 2 hours advertised for that discontinued ($700) Carvin Sub but probably NOT the 5-6 hours I get from S1s.

I have a Phil Jones Briefcase ($999 street price).  It has great tone and there's a DI built in so you COULD run a cable to your S1 for a bit more sound level in the 100-1KhZ range.  And you can use it as a great practice/small gig amp or as an onstage bass monitor that you plug into large sound system.

nightoul posted:

Oh okay then. It seems that a battery sub is generally a questionable concept... I've also read somebody say on another forum that Mattel makes some. Haha.

Looked at the Mattel model sub but didn't think much of it.  However, this Fisher Price looks like it could be the ticket!

 

Last edited by Archtop Eddy

Hi Troubador.

troubador posted:

I'm curious to learn and looking at the illustration above ... does the connection from the sub to the S1 have to be an XLR->TRS or can it be an XLR->XLR (i.e. XLR into the S1 vs TRS into the S1).

Sorry if it's a dumb question but I'm trying to learn ...

Thanks

XLR to XLR will work.

XLR to 1/4 inch (6.3 mm) Tip-Ring-Sleeve is a better match because the subwoofer output is line-level, and the S1 Pro 1/4 inch input is line-level.

The S1 Pro XLR input is microphone level.

ST

The problem with subs in 'conventional' systems is that the highest frequencies they reproduce are pretty low, much music doesn't have this frequencies (guitars, ad vocals will never trouble the sub, bass will but only in it's bottom octave).

We are so used to hearing 'great bass' from small speakers (think ghetto blasters and modern bluetooth speakers like the Bose Revolve) and we forget that these devices don't reproduce bass at all. All decent commercial mixes exploit the fact that our brains fill in the gaps (the science is known as 'psyco-acoustics) and the guys mixing this stuff make sure the bass instruments have lots of harmonic content to remind us that they are there.

A sub woofer will not put out much that you can hear, and what you can hear will be woolly and indistinct, if it's a good sub you'll feel it more than hear it but a poor one (like nearly all 12" and smaller subs) will only reproduce a very limited range of notes at any noticeable volume.

FWIW I'm a fan of Behringer gear but I cannot imagine the B1200D is any better than the EV Z1 I sold for that exact reason.

ST posted:

Hi Troubador.

XLR to XLR will work.

XLR to 1/4 inch (6.3 mm) Tip-Ring-Sleeve is a better match because the subwoofer output is line-level, and the S1 Pro 1/4 inch input is line-level.

The S1 Pro XLR input is microphone level.

ST

Thanks, @ST ... that makes it clear. I wasn't aware of the different input levels of the S1. I'm glad I asked - I've learned something new!

Cheers,

Sam Spoons posted:

The problem with subs in 'conventional' systems is that the highest frequencies they reproduce are pretty low, much music doesn't have this frequencies (guitars, ad vocals will never trouble the sub, bass will but only in it's bottom octave).

We are so used to hearing 'great bass' from small speakers (think ghetto blasters and modern bluetooth speakers like the Bose Revolve) and we forget that these devices don't reproduce bass at all. All decent commercial mixes exploit the fact that our brains fill in the gaps (the science is known as 'psyco-acoustics) and the guys mixing this stuff make sure the bass instruments have lots of harmonic content to remind us that they are there.

A sub woofer will not put out much that you can hear, and what you can hear will be woolly and indistinct, if it's a good sub you'll feel it more than hear it but a poor one (like nearly all 12" and smaller subs) will only reproduce a very limited range of notes at any noticeable volume.

FWIW I'm a fan of Behringer gear but I cannot imagine the B1200D is any better than the EV Z1 I sold for that exact reason.

Very interesting points and well presented. Bravo Sam!  I don't know much about psyco-acoustics and what-not but my personal experience with the B1200D and my S1Pro was exactly as you said.  I could "feel" the bass-thump but, as for hearing the notes, they tended to sound woolly and indistinct.

For these reasons and the fact the B1200D wasn't battery-powered and was large and heavy (compared to the S1Pro), I returned it to the store and chose to wait for a proper bass sub from Bose. I'm not sure if Bose will ever make such a sub, but for me it would be worth the wait. I just don't need a booming sub that much. 

Now some people on this forum have had great success with the B1200D and I'm happy for them.  I'm just a singer, acoustic soloist so my musical needs may be quite different from theirs. As they say, your mileage may vary, and I wish you each the best musical gear to meet your musical journey.

Archtop Eddy posted:
Sam Spoons posted:

The problem with subs in 'conventional' systems is that the highest frequencies they reproduce are pretty low, much music doesn't have this frequencies (guitars, ad vocals will never trouble the sub, bass will but only in it's bottom octave).

We are so used to hearing 'great bass' from small speakers (think ghetto blasters and modern bluetooth speakers like the Bose Revolve) and we forget that these devices don't reproduce bass at all. All decent commercial mixes exploit the fact that our brains fill in the gaps (the science is known as 'psyco-acoustics) and the guys mixing this stuff make sure the bass instruments have lots of harmonic content to remind us that they are there.

A sub woofer will not put out much that you can hear, and what you can hear will be woolly and indistinct, if it's a good sub you'll feel it more than hear it but a poor one (like nearly all 12" and smaller subs) will only reproduce a very limited range of notes at any noticeable volume.

FWIW I'm a fan of Behringer gear but I cannot imagine the B1200D is any better than the EV Z1 I sold for that exact reason.

Very interesting points and well presented. Bravo Sam!  I don't know much about psyco-acoustics and what-not but my personal experience with the B1200D and my S1Pro was exactly as you said.  I could "feel" the bass-thump but, as for hearing the notes, they tended to sound woolly and indistinct.

For these reasons and the fact the B1200D wasn't battery-powered and was large and heavy (compared to the S1Pro), I returned it to the store and chose to wait for a proper bass sub from Bose. I'm not sure if Bose will ever make such a sub, but for me it would be worth the wait. I just don't need a booming sub that much. 

Now some people on this forum have had great success with the B1200D and I'm happy for them.  I'm just a singer, acoustic soloist so my musical needs may be quite different from theirs. As they say, your mileage may vary, and I wish you each the best musical gear to meet your musical journey.

Absolutely, and well put Eddy. Realistically guitars and vocals should never trouble the sub in a conventional rig* as they don't do anything below 82Hz (for a guitar at least). The only time an acoustic guitarist might benefit from a sub is when playing percussive styles but, even then probably not.

A bit of 'thump' is great for DJs and, as they are playing heavily compressed commercial tracks they are relatively kind to the subs, live music less so as it's usually far more dynamic.

* The S1 LF extension is not great so something that goes lower might give a small benefit but it would need to be effective up to around 100-120 Hz which cheap subs rarely are.

Psychoacoustics

Psychoacoustics is the study of how sound is perceived. It’s at the very foundation of how Bose creates its audio products and, in fact, goes all the way back to the inception of the company. Dr Bose saw that other speakers had specs that only measured how they made his music sound, not how he heard it.

In a lecture at MIT, Dr Bose once gave the following example: “You can put engineers in a room and give them the task of lowering distortion, and they will do this merrily for years. But there’s a basic question: does this mean anything with respect to perception? The distortion—though you can read it on meters—maybe isn’t audible. Well, if it isn’t audible, what are you doing that’s worthwhile here except achieving some particular engineering goal?”

The 2201 speaker was the first Direct/Reflecting speaker we produced, and it paved the way for the legendary 901 speaker system.

Source: The Story of Bose



DavidE2 posted:
Sam Spoons posted:
DavidE2 posted:

I need to try my L1C sub only with the S1s.  No crossover, but might be nice to add some thump. 

You might as well just take the L1C 

You would think, but there are times I think the L1C sounds a bit harsh.  The S1s just sound much warmer and fuller to me.

You have better ears then me then (not that hard TBH) but it might just be that you are overdriving the inputs a little, used in it's designed rabnge I didn't find the L1C to be at all harsh. But agreed the S1 is not harsh either.

There is a control on the Behringer sub that allows one to set the frequency for the high-pass filter.  I set mine near the top of the range near 150 Hz.

I find that there is audio content from my baritone voice and guitars that are psycho-acoustically (and physically) enhanced when my sub is turned on when compared to the sound of just the two Bose S1 Pros without the sub.

So I won't be returning my Behringer 1200s... 

Although I find that just one is enough so I may sell my other one to a friend.

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